The verdict is in !

:eek: :eek: :eek:
 
To have a Contractor ran org. would be ideal because most of us here are Contractors. I don't think its an Us vs Them mentality when it comes to us the Contractors and them the Distributors/Manufacturers. In most case scenarios the Dist/Man is the ones with the deeper pockets and besides that quite a few of them were also contractors at one time.

I can't say I know because I don't what Carlos and some others have planned with the UAMCC. I do believe that they want the UAMCC to be a contractor ran org. Maybe all there eventual Board of Directors will have to be current contractors. I'm guessing that for the UAMCC org. to be a successful org. they will need to have good working relationships with Dist/Man. Does that mean they should let them become members?? I think they should. I also believed that the BOD's should be any potential member with so many being Contractors and a smaller amount being Dist/Man. That seem to be an unpopular belief with most but it seems to me to be the fairest way to have a Board as long as everything stays above board(Honesty).

I don't think you can have a successful Contractor only Org. because of Money always being a factor. Now if a contractor wanted to donate a ton of money to a Contractor only org. then maybe that would tip the scale a little more in favor of a contractor only org. To be truly successful from what I seen in the past the contractors will need the Dist/Man. to work with them.

This is only speculation from me because I really do not know what the UAMCC has in store for there future.
 
Clean County PW said:
To have a Contractor ran org. would be ideal because most of us here are Contractors. I don't think its an Us vs Them mentality when it comes to us the Contractors and them the Distributors/Manufacturers. In most case scenarios the Dist/Man is the ones with the deeper pockets and besides that quite a few of them were also contractors at one time.

I can't say I know because I don't what Carlos and some others have planned with the UAMCC. I do believe that they want the UAMCC to be a contractor ran org. Maybe all there eventual Board of Directors will have to be current contractors. I'm guessing that for the UAMCC org. to be a successful org. they will need to have good working relationships with Dist/Man. Does that mean they should let them become members?? I think they should. I also believed that the BOD's should be any potential member with so many being Contractors and a smaller amount being Dist/Man. That seem to be an unpopular belief with most but it seems to me to be the fairest way to have a Board as long as everything stays above board(Honesty).

I don't think you can have a successful Contractor only Org. because of Money always being a factor. Now if a contractor wanted to donate a ton of money to a Contractor only org. then maybe that would tip the scale a little more in favor of a contractor only org. To be truly successful from what I seen in the past the contractors will need the Dist/Man. to work with them.

This is only speculation from me because I really do not know what the UAMCC has in store for there future.
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I don't think you can give promises or control to them. No voting power as thier agendas may often times conflict with the Contractors. That said, the way to introduce vendor/dist dollars into the revenue of an ORG is to sell advertising spots on website, monthly newsletters, table tops at round tables/conventions. If there is a large enough member base, believe me, they will know it is a good investment to pay to get thier wares/services in front of the members/potential members. Then these vendors will have to do as we do for our customers.... Compete on quality and good customer service. Good for us as we'll be getting the best instead of whan an ORG told us to buy.

Here is a small example of what I am talking about.... We all know here that I really like my Friend BOB at Pressuretek. I respect his business practices and think he's a great father waking up each morning to go to work to afford raising his family. However, Bob has opposite agendas than I do. His business is to sell chems and equipment. This is why I wouldn't even want my FRIEND on a board with a voting power. You see, if my local Car Dealership calls Bob and wants to order a skid so that they can do washing in-house, Bob will take the order and ship the machine. I don't fault Bob for that.. That is his Business and livelihood. I however, in my locality, want to push for Licensing to make it harder for that Dealer to be able to use his in-house $8.00/hr laborer to wash while knocking the local Contract Cleaners out of an opportunity to get a cleaning contract. When an ORG begins planning a campaign to move toward Licensing/certification for cleaners to be able to work, we don't need a voting member to be there crying foul because it will mean less machines being sold straight to end users. Those end users will have to go get licensed and certified to clean on thier properties. It is so bad here, that our local vendors don't even consider Contract Cleaners thier base customers. They focus on selling to Factories and Businesses to do in-house cleaning bypassing us. See how that agenda conflicts with ours? (Our agenda should be to Getting those cleaning contracts as we are the ones with the proper knowledge of regulations and best/safest methods)
Do we often time know more than our Vendor about Cleaning? You bet! My local Vendor doesn't even carry Large orriffice tips. They question why on earth I would want one. This is why they like the local factory buying a machine as they know it will be back in a week because an unqualified user damaged the machine and now needs to be fixed at $75/hr. Seperate agendas!!

I hope some can see the point I am making. I feel that for far too long, vendors/Distributors/manufacturers have been placing all the importance on the equipment and less on the actual Contractors. This is why we are viewed as just Laborers using some equipment. They have Orgs that they can join to make thier businesses better and to network. We need our own ORG. If they want to sell us products, they can do it just like we have to do it. Advertise and compete right along side eachother. May the best Customer Service win!!! Pay for placement at our Round Tables. Pay for spots in our newsletters with no promises of exclusivity. Pay for that banner on the website knowing that another banner is there too. Be confident that thier products/service is worthy of competing.
 
A long time ago on another BBS I made a post about pushing for licensing in the pressure washing industry for some of the same reasons Michael mentioned above. To stop the hacks and low ballers, gain recognition for the PW industry and to protect consumers properties.

I got slammed so hard by so many contractors for it because some were worried about being watched by big brother, licensing was a scam created by government to make money ect ect.. I'm glad that others are starting to think about this.

In Maryland, you need a home improvement license to tighten a nail or screw, and to apply deck sealer. However, you can power wash a cedar deck with 4,000 PSI and a turbo nozzle but you don't need a license to do it! What kind of stupidity is that?

It's just too damn easy to get into this industry by walking into your local HD and buying a pressure washer. There needs to be some type of regulation and there needs to be some checks and balances in place to raise the bar in this industry. When I was on the BOD for PWNA, I pushed for the license and insurance requirements and they finally got implemented. I won't comment on this org because I don't know anything about it either but I do hope that any future org has some type of checks and balances on the members that join.

Thats one of the big reasons why I don't post on boards much anymore. We don't know who's getting the information were putting out. How do we know that were not giving away all of our trade secrets and tricks that took us years to learn to some guy that just started up? A new startup that has a much lower overhead than you do so he can bid jobs lower than you using your own methods and marketing that YOU gave him??? How do you know there isn't 10 guys on this bbs within 1 mile of your house??? Especially when the economy is going down and guys are losing their jobs and looking for a way to make quick money. Am I being unreasonable? Maybe so but I've seen it happen to other guys on these boards.

The requirements for licensing and insurance would help to counterbalance this to some extent because they would set a minimum standard.

Another guy wrote a huge post on this a while back, I think his name was Cory or something like that. It was a great read and it's something that everyone should think about. Are we creating more competition for ourselves?

Most of you know me, and you know that I've always been willing to help someone out, answer questions and do what I can for the industry but there has to be a line somewhere. What kind of effect will the free information on these BBS's have in this industry in 5 more years?

Some BBS's like TGS have gone private to protect their members from having a customer see them ask how to do their job (and other reasons) and I think it's a good idea. I also think that these BBS's can be a good tool for teaching guys how to do things the right way which can help our industry by raising the bar. BUT, by raising the bar, you allow more traffic in at the same time which causes more competition.

I've been in business for 19 years now so I've noticed the huge growth in this industry over the years, Right now there is plenty of work out there to do for everyone. But, what happens in another five years of BBS's and no set standards for the industry???
 
Russ Spence said:
Awesome Henry ! All good point
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All right on the money, except I think TGS is open again?


Russ Spence said:
So what can be done ? How ? Who is willing ?
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Up to this point I've always been like Groucho Marx:
"I won't belong to any organization that would have me as a member."

I never thought I would change my mind but Lord help me, I'm just about ready to jump in this ditch and start digging.
:(
 
I cant imagine ever having to have a license to pressure wash. Even if there were such a thing, it wouldnt stop newbies from doing it anyway. Lets not be a bunch of panzies. Ive been in this business for 9 years and got most of my accounts from my dad whose been in business for 33 years. Noones gonna take your business. Noone really wants to get into this business anyway. Who in high school says they want a pressure washing business. I didnt. In my opinion our economy is full of folks that like a steady paycheck, and most dont like to have off on weekends. I think with the knowledge most of you know about business, and the difficulty it is to successfully run a pressure washing business, any one of you could pick up a new business and run it successfully any time you really feel like it anyways. My 2 cents.
 
JMSC said:
I cant imagine ever having to have a license to pressure wash. Even if there were such a thing, it wouldnt stop newbies from doing it anyway. Lets not be a bunch of panzies. Ive been in this business for 9 years and got most of my accounts from my dad whose been in business for 33 years. Noones gonna take your business. Noone really wants to get into this business anyway. Who in high school says they want a pressure washing business. I didnt. In my opinion our economy is full of folks that like a steady paycheck, and most dont like to have off on weekends. I think with the knowledge most of you know about business, and the difficulty it is to successfully run a pressure washing business, any one of you could pick up a new business and run it successfully any time you really feel like it anyways. My 2 cents.
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I don't think the issue people advocating licensing have is protecting their customer base, but rather protecting the consumer. The idea is if a set of standards were to be put into place, and licensed operators of pressure washing businesses had to adhere to those standards or risk losing their license, you could reduce the likelihood of the consumer suffering a bad experience. The more difficult you make it for the hacks to enter the industry, the more difficult you make it for them to ruin it as well.
 
BUNN said:
I don't think the issue people advocating licensing have is protecting their customer base, but rather protecting the consumer. The idea is if a set of standards were to be put into place, and licensed operators of pressure washing businesses had to adhere to those standards or risk losing their license, you could reduce the likelihood of the consumer suffering a bad experience. The more difficult you make it for the hacks to enter the industry, the more difficult you make it for them to ruin it as well.
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Exactly.
 
agree to disagree

I have my reasons. I have thought about getting into a new field. Always been too many loopholes, too many education classes, too much b.s. They will always tell you its just to weed out the competition. Yes, I can see your point if you want to push licensing for say roof cleaning or maybe hood cleaning, Ive never done either, and would be afraid to without some sort of training, but just pressure washing in general, your hurting the small guy with a few bucks in his pocket from ever getting out from under his minimum wage paying job.
 
JMSC said:
agree to disagree

I have my reasons. I have thought about getting into a new field. Always been too many loopholes, too many education classes, too much b.s. They will always tell you its just to weed out the competition. Yes, I can see your point if you want to push licensing for say roof cleaning or maybe hood cleaning, Ive never done either, and would be afraid to without some sort of training, but just pressure washing in general, your hurting the small guy with a few bucks in his pocket from ever getting out from under his minimum wage paying job.
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Or saving what professionalism is actually left in our industry. Saving a family from haveing to foot the bill of mold remediation because an unaware minimum wage worker decided he'd blast someones siding with 3500 psi to make some extra beer money on the side. Uninsured and non-registered folks cause the rest of us to have to pay higher taxes and higher premiums for workers comp. In addition to making it tougher to land accounts at profitable prices because folks think it is possible to get serviced for less. It is not possble to make a living at some of the rates we often bid against. (Not legally)

The only thing stopping a "small guy" from getting out of a minimum wage job is lack of education. Simply buying a pressure washer doesn't make you a legit business. I am beat to death with all the $5 and $10 crap we as legal businesses have to spend each day/week/year to stay legal. While bubba down the street with no formal education in business or access to consultants freely runs around bypassing all the legalities pricing work so low that it is impossible to profit if he were legal. Friggin' fire extinguishers, first aid kits, folders for MSDS sheets, documented safety meetings, documented everything, matching FICA on TRUE employees, unemployment insurance, Workers comp, payroll processing..... The list goes on with things that bubba isn't aware of. The least we can ask for is a system that will monitor Pressure washing Businesses through licensing and providing proof of insurances. There is too much damage to be done to just allow any Joe Blow have the License without proving financial responsibility through insurance. I have consulted many locals in my area and the only ones against Licensing are the ones hiding money from IRS or no insurance or hiring illegals and not paying any payroll expenses. All of which hurt the rest of us. This would also protect that small guy from going out and purchasing a pressure washer and on his first job cleaning a bank drive-thru and finding out the hard way that he will be fined for spraying all his waste water towards a Storm drain at the end of the street. Had he gone through proper cycles, he'd be made aware of CWA or permits needed and liabillty.
Lots of professions are governed by Licensing due to the delicate nature of thier businesses. Electricians could cause fires if not installing systems properly. So there is a licensing sytem in place to monitor who, where and what is being done. If you think pressure washing is just a simple job with no ramifications to the enviroment or risks to peoples properties, you're wrong. This isn't monkeys play. Everyone here wants to see our customers get quality work done. Why wouldn't we want to rid the industry of the guys that are still Blasting someones Vinyl Siding because they wanted to leave the only job they qualified for and start a "Business" without doing thier due diligence and becoming educated as to what it take to properly run a legit Business?
 
JMSC said:
agree to disagree

I have my reasons. I have thought about getting into a new field. Always been too many loopholes, too many education classes, too much b.s. They will always tell you its just to weed out the competition. Yes, I can see your point if you want to push licensing for say roof cleaning or maybe hood cleaning, Ive never done either, and would be afraid to without some sort of training, but just pressure washing in general, your hurting the small guy with a few bucks in his pocket from ever getting out from under his minimum wage paying job.
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Don't get me wrong, I don't want to see licensing cost a new contractor an arm and a leg, and keep someone from chasing their dream of owning a business. I like the idea of contractors being licensed, so that if they screw things up, they can have their license revoked (unlike certain "certifications":rolleyes: ). That way if a contractor loses his/her license, in theory, they can no longer do any more harm to the industry.

IMO, there is a lot more to this industry than "just pressure washing". There is more to cleaning a deck than "just pressure washing". (Find out what happens if you substitute 4,000PSI for proper chemical application, and a low pressure rinse.) There is more to fleet washing than "just pressure washing". (Same as before, find out what 4,000PSI will do to the decals on those trucks) There is more to cleaning buildings than "just pressure washing" (I think you get the point by now) In any of the above situations, the consumer would be left with damage, caused by someone who was "just pressure washing". See what I mean?
 
Actually to make it just to Roof Cleaning and KEC is a direct admission of what you are worried about , in other words its ok as long as it does not bother you , if you have been in business 9 years you should have nothing to worry about , as far as roofs go that would make no since to have to license one and not the other , I am unsure of your thinking , the homeowners protection and the contractors level of expertese are what is in question

I see countless people daily who say "well I have had pressure washing done before ..... BUT " and then they begain to tell me about the hacks and folks that have done it before and ruined our image and last but not least cheapened it dramatically.

Why not educate the contractors through manditory certification ? This would insure that at worst we will start to raise our stakes in the already questionable industry.

Point is this we have to be bigger than the average hack , yep I can wire a home , but insurance wont pay if it burns up. I know it is not going to remidy the problem from the start but through a industry wide effort its a place to start.
 
guys, maybe you are right. I dont make near the money you guys probably do, I have a few accounts ive had for years, kind of been out of the scene. If you are really husling like you must be you probably see a lot more of what your saying is hurting our industry.

One more thing, of all the years weve been in business, only one of my dads employees ever went into business for himself and he was trained. This is out of hundreds of people that didnt. So, I just dont see new people getting into this stuff. Used to, someone had to know how to at least put one of these rigs together, now of course, you can buy one set up. Maybe thats part of the problem.
 
Holy cow.....new pressure washing companies pop up in droves every year!! The amount of money people make has been put out there so much, everybody thinks this is the thing to do these days!

Vote YES to licensing/certification!
 
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