EPA Enforcement in 2012 Protects Communities From Harmful Pollution

Robert Hinderliter said:
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Any questions call Robert's Cell 817-366-3041
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The title in your above post that I and many others have a problem with Robert saying that that gas station is typical and that it is typical pollution from mobile contract cleaners, I don't see any that bad in my area and when I travel around the country to conventions and round tables each year, sometimes 4 to 6 times a year in the past, that is not a typical gas station at all from what I have seen all around the country, so that is not a typical gas station or typical stains.

WE ARE NOT POLLUTERS, WE CLEAN UP THE POLLUTION.

The pollution is there, it is pre-existing, we just properly remove it.

There probably have been contractors in the past, maybe even now that did the wrong thing but we as an industry are trying to change things so we are looked upon with some respect and help people out there to understand that we are the solution to the pollution, we did not put it there, we are removing it before the rain can wash it into the US waterways and contaminate them.

I Seriously would change that title as it is not helping us all with our image, it sounds scary and I think it would scare people if they read it. I am not sure if it was meant to be scary but it does have that affect.

From a contractor's point of view, your title is making it sound like all contractors are polluters when we all are cleaning up the pollution and making the environment a lot cleaner place for us, our families and our children. I think it is safe to say that most of all mobile contract cleaners are doing the right thing these days but we all are trying to make the world a cleaner place for everyone by properly cleaning up pre-existing situations and making them safer for everyone.



I really don't see the benefit in that choice of title, maybe you can tell me why you chose to use that title instead of something like, "Mobile Contract Cleaners can remove these stains, chemical residue and other pre-existing pollution from the surface and properly process and dispose of the wash water" ? ? ? Not trying to bash you or start an argument here, just wondering why the title? ? ?



I think that the current group of contract cleaners are many, many times more conscious of the cleaning we do, the issues we face and the potential problems we face if we do the wrong thing compared to the contract cleaners of 10, 15, 20 years ago so we need to help educate the public, not scare them into understanding what we do, the pollution we remove (we do not create pollution, we remove it to make the area safe for everyone) and how we make the environment cleaner and to help maintain the cleanliness for our customers.

There are so many leaky cars on the road, most probably will never get the leaks fixed for one or more reasons so we are there to properly clean the area and make it safe for everyone so that this stuff does not go into the US Waterways when it rains. When we clean up these situations we are removing leaky car pollution (we are not leaky cars and do not cause the pollution, we clean and remove the pollution) and helping the environment to be a cleaner place for everyone.

There are other pre-existing pollutants on properties that you listed that we as mobile contract cleaners can properly remove to leave the properties cleaner and pollution-free and safe for everyone. We need to educate the public that we are removing the pre-existing pollution, we are not causing the pre-existing pollution, I think we all can agree that we are cleaning up the pre-existing pollution and properly processing it and disposing of it properly.

If there are people out there doing the wrong thing after all this time, they need to be educated but if they are not-caring or repeat offenders then it is time for the authorities to get involved and handle them as they are a problem not only for us, the community but also the environment as well.
 
We are cleaning up the Pre-existing pollution on those properties that came from leaky cars, people that over-fill their fuel tanks and other machinery, we did not cause the pre-existing pollution on those properties but the picture you posted above is not typical of what I see in my area or when I travel around the country to pressure washing events and see gas stations and other areas that are cleaned commercially.
 
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Christopher said:
The title in your above post that I and many others have a problem with Robert saying that that gas station is typical and that it is typical pollution from mobile contract cleaners, I don't see any that bad in my area and when I travel around the country to conventions and round tables each year, sometimes 4 to 6 times a year in the past, that is not a typical gas station at all from what I have seen all around the country, so that is not a typical gas station or typical stains.

WE ARE NOT POLLUTERS, WE CLEAN UP THE POLLUTION.

The pollution is there, it is pre-existing, we just properly remove it.

There probably have been contractors in the past, maybe even now that did the wrong thing but we as an industry are trying to change things so we are looked upon with some respect and help people out there to understand that we are the solution to the pollution, we did not put it there, we are removing it before the rain can wash it into the US waterways and contaminate them.

I Seriously would change that title as it is not helping us all with our image, it sounds scary and I think it would scare people if they read it. I am not sure if it was meant to be scary but it does have that affect.

From a contractor's point of view, your title is making it sound like all contractors are polluters when we all are cleaning up the pollution and making the environment a lot cleaner place for us, our families and our children. I think it is safe to say that most of all mobile contract cleaners are doing the right thing these days but we all are trying to make the world a cleaner place for everyone by properly cleaning up pre-existing situations and making them safer for everyone.



I really don't see the benefit in that choice of title, maybe you can tell me why you chose to use that title instead of something like, "Mobile Contract Cleaners can remove these stains, chemical residue and other pre-existing pollution from the surface and properly process and dispose of the wash water" ? ? ? Not trying to bash you or start an argument here, just wondering why the title? ? ?l.
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I did not choose or change that titie. I borrowed those slides from an AHJ in that series. Almost none of these slides are as I wrote them, they have been altered and changes many times by other stakeholders (contractore, AHJs, etc).

The final version was what I could get a concensus on. I have always said the Oregon has the best plan, but no one will agree, so you have to do what you can get agreement on.

Yes, I know it an uphill battle on this forum. A lot of education will have to be done before I will be accepted.
 
Robert Hinderliter said:
I did not choose or change that titie. I borrowed those slides from an AHJ in that series. Almost none of these slides are as I wrote them, they have been altered and changes many times by other stakeholders (contractore, AHJs, etc).

The final version was what I could get a concensus on. I have always said the Oregon has the best plan, but no one will agree, so you have to do what you can get agreement on.

Yes, I know it an uphill battle on this forum. A lot of education will have to be done before I will be accepted.
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I fail to see any education here. This is an attempt at indoctrination.

There is no way I, or any responsible power washer would ever repost false representations of what our industry really does and call it "education".

What's next? A list of articles from newspapers falsely accusing us of using all the water so the children die of dehydration?

We are asking you to please stop hurting the children of power washers who depend on their parents to make a living to feed then


What exactly is your goal here Robert?

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2
 
Christopher said:
There probably have been contractors in the past, maybe even now that did the wrong thing but we as an industry are trying to change things so we are looked upon with some respect and help people out there to understand that we are the solution to the pollution, we did not put it there, we are removing it before the rain can wash it into the US waterways and contaminate them.

I Seriously would change that title as it is not helping us all with our image, it sounds scary and I think it would scare people if they read it. I am not sure if it was meant to be scary but it does have that affect.

From a contractor's point of view, your title is making it sound like all contractors are polluters when we all are cleaning up the pollution and making the environment a lot cleaner place for us, our families and our children. I think it is safe to say that most of all mobile contract cleaners are doing the right thing these days but we all are trying to make the world a cleaner place for everyone by properly cleaning up pre-existing situations and making them safer for everyone.



I really don't see the benefit in that choice of title, maybe you can tell me why you chose to use that title instead of something like, "Mobile Contract Cleaners can remove these stains, chemical residue and other pre-existing pollution from the surface and properly process and dispose of the wash water" ? ? ? Not trying to bash you or start an argument here, just wondering why the title? ? ?



I think that the current group of contract cleaners are many, many times more conscious of the cleaning we do, the issues we face and the potential problems we face if we do the wrong thing compared to the contract cleaners of 10, 15, 20 years ago so we need to help educate the public, not scare them into understanding what we do, the pollution we remove (we do not create pollution, we remove it to make the area safe for everyone) and how we make the environment cleaner and to help maintain the cleanliness for our customers.

There are so many leaky cars on the road, most probably will never get the leaks fixed for one or more reasons so we are there to properly clean the area and make it safe for everyone so that this stuff does not go into the US Waterways when it rains. When we clean up these situations we are removing leaky car pollution (we are not leaky cars and do not cause the pollution, we clean and remove the pollution) and helping the environment to be a cleaner place for everyone.

There are other pre-existing pollutants on properties that you listed that we as mobile contract cleaners can properly remove to leave the properties cleaner and pollution-free and safe for everyone. We need to educate the public that we are removing the pre-existing pollution, we are not causing the pre-existing pollution, I think we all can agree that we are cleaning up the pre-existing pollution and properly processing it and disposing of it properly.

If there are people out there doing the wrong thing after all this time, they need to be educated but if they are not-caring or repeat offenders then it is time for the authorities to get involved and handle them as they are a problem not only for us, the community but also the environment as well.
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Chris:

You say you are disposing of the waste water properly, but you never said where that is. Those words have no meaning unless you list your discharge locations.

Ron is saying to use Storm Water Remediation Systems: retention ponds, detention ponds, Wet Pond, gravel and sand filters, Bioretention/Raingarden, etc. This is not going to fly. Power Washing Waste Water carries more pollutants than does a rain event, and our waste water can overload these systems.

This argument can go on forever, therefore I have invited several AHJs to join this discussion. Presently they are deciding who will start responding. Presently I am hoping it will be several AHJs from several levels of government all across America.

Several AHJs have already reviewed this thread, at my request and others.

Hopefully by the end of the week you can direct your questions to AHJs, I have told them I am getting beat up pretty bad and what the issues are.
 
Tony Shelton said:
I fail to see any education here. This is an attempt at indoctrination.

There is no way I, or any responsible power washer would ever repost false representations of what our industry really does and call it "education".

What's next? A list of articles from newspapers falsely accusing us of using all the water so the children die of dehydration?

We are asking you to please stop hurting the children of power washers who depend on their parents to make a living to feed then


What exactly is your goal here Robert?

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2
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My Daddy always said (I grew up and a 1,800 acre ranch & farm): "Bob, you can take your horse to water but you cannot make him drink!"
 
Robert Hinderliter said:
My Daddy always said (I grew up and a 1,800 acre ranch & farm): "Bob, you can take your horse to water but you cannot make him drink!"
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Mine always said. You can take a horse to water and if you LEAD him the right way, he WILL WANT to drink it when he gets there. Didn't grow up on a ranch or farm, just had a Dad that was and is a great leader.
 
So now Robert has lined up AHJ's sympathetic with his desire to promote us as polluters to come on here and shore up his position.

Where are the responsible PWNA members? Are there any left at all? If you were members of a hunting org would you support a chairman who brought in Peta to argue and show you how wrong you are for hunting?

Is there anybody in the PWNA who even cares about this industry at all?
 
I really tried to objectively look at this thread and keep up. Forgive my limited scope of view on this but I guess I need to ask one thing of you Robert? I have seen the responses from many of the contractors you would like to speak for. I've even talked personally to a few. The general consensus I get is that they don't feel you should represent the industry to authorities until you are given that right by the industry. Now I see you have encouraged others outside the industry to come here and see how you are "getting beat up pretty bad and what the issues are". To me that says you want things your way and if you don't get it you will force it. Please understand I don't know you personally and it would be easy to get the wrong impression from a lengthy heated internet dispute. However, when the thrust of the argument is - let us as an industry come to a consensus - and you decide to bring in outside sources to help you fight for your way it doesn't' lend weight to your argument to me. But hey, I'm a lowly window cleaner who happens to do some pressure cleaning so take it for what it's worth.
 
The problem in here is that none of you except for Robert and myself have ever sat in with gov't officials. What Chris says above and contractors in general think the same is wishful thinking and we all would love that. What your not understanding is that there's a system in place.
For one the EPA can squish everyone in here. Wish all you want and say You can take down a Lisa Jackson for example and if you know anything about this stuff the president of the United States can't even take her down.

There's a system in place. You need to work that system. Beating each other up here is not going to get your or this industry anywhere.

Look closely at what Tony for example put up a few post back about the Vegas BMP's. You can't even rinse over an oil sheen and direct that to landscape.

Every where we clean there is something they can pin on you if they want to. You can't go in there and say "hey pal where cleaning the sidewalks and we aren't using chemicals so the run off can go anywhere". There not going to listen.

Tell them this.. "hey pal according to the Internet we can do this and that because I researched it".
Shutdown.......

You need to go in there with answers that they can see as being acceptable. Don't forget your going to deal with people in here that have PHD's in this stuff. Rule out that your dealing with dummies.

Robert himself had a masters degree in engineering. Does't mean he is necessarily smarter then some of us. Heck Bill Gates flunked out of Yale and Brooke Shields graduated from Princeton with honors.(Calvin Klein under ware star).

Wishing is one thing.. Doing is another. Making it real and not some internet promotion is what you want.
 
mistersqueegee said:
I really tried to objectively look at this thread and keep up. Forgive my limited scope of view on this but I guess I need to ask one thing of you Robert? I have seen the responses from many of the contractors you would like to speak for. I've even talked personally to a few. The general consensus I get is that they don't feel you should represent the industry to authorities until you are given that right by the industry. Now I see you have encouraged others outside the industry to come here and see how you are "getting beat up pretty bad and what the issues are". To me that says you want things your way and if you don't get it you will force it. Please understand I don't know you personally and it would be easy to get the wrong impression from a lengthy heated internet dispute. However, when the thrust of the argument is - let us as an industry come to a consensus - and you decide to bring in outside sources to help you fight for your way it doesn't' lend weight to your argument to me. But hey, I'm a lowly window cleaner who happens to do some pressure cleaning so take it for what it's worth.
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Tony go talk to a regulator or better yet go talk to someone who directly works for the EPA. Let us know what you come back with.
 
Tony Shelton said:
So now Robert has lined up AHJ's sympathetic with his desire to promote us as polluters to come on here and shore up his position.

Where are the responsible PWNA members? Are there any left at all? If you were members of a hunting org would you support a chairman who brought in Peta to argue and show you how wrong you are for hunting?

Is there anybody in the PWNA who even cares about this industry at all?
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Sorry, but the EPA will clarify their position. I have no input on the EPA's position.

What you need to do it get ready to converse with them, and forget about me. I have given you the opportunity for a national stage, to make a difference that counts; not just words and attacks.

I have asked several others to view this thread, and the normal response is it is not worth their time, sorry.
 
Clean County PW said:
Tony go talk to a regulator or better yet go talk to someone who directly works for the EPA. Let us know what you come back with.
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John while I respect your position I think you missed my point. If you think the government agencies are tough now, wait til they figure out that they can cram more regulation on the industry because there are those who will openly embrace it. First the industry must set it's own house in order then the government regulators will be dealing with a united front which is harder to ignore. Of course that's just my opinion. I didn't expect you to agree.
 
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