Calgary hood cleaning requirements

Tammy Tuhkala

New member
One-Man crews

RJTravel said:
Question for Tammy:
Apparently you are well acquainted with Ace's mode & method - they have included your manuals for every student since at least 2002 - see 'Hood Cleaning School' thread below - post is dated 4/2/2002. Certainly they have ordered many score if not hundreds of manuals from you. I have not read the manual (sniff), but perhaps you can tell me - they cling tenaciously to and actually try to defend the dangerous 'one-man' crew modality. Does either Phil Ackland or the manual itself actually advocate, teach, or suggest this mode?
Richard

Phil Ackland has opposed the "one-man" crew modality since it was first mentioned by Rusty (see numerous previous threads on the subject). Hence, the "crude copy missing important components" - mainly safety.
 

grizzley

Member
Tammy Tuhkala said:
Phil Ackland has opposed the "one-man" crew modality since it was first mentioned by Rusty (see numerous previous threads on the subject). Hence, the "crude copy missing important components" - mainly safety.

But, how is a one man crew unsafe to the point that it is opposed? I'd like to think that is a personal choice of each individual. Maybe I am missing something that you can point out.
 

mtngoat

Member
Always nice to have a second pair of hands around and a second pair of eyes as we clean in the evenings quite a bit.
 

grizzley

Member
mtngoat said:
Always nice to have a second pair of hands around and a second pair of eyes as we clean in the evenings quite a bit.

That's great....but I fail to see where that is a safety concern where Phil Ackland's class would not want to see a one man crew.

I think we can all list benefits, but I am wondering about the safety concerns that Tammy is referring to.
 

mbryan

New member
There are rumors that Phil and Rusty have worked out all of their differences and they will now be working together much more closely.
 
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dodsonish

Grease Police President
Matt-

That's terrible. How's the real movie doing at the box office in LA?


You are only as safe as yourself. My helper does not keep me from falling off a ladder, or slicing my forearem open with a razor scraper. The helper makes the job easier, but is not necessary to keep me safe.

Rusty's school teaches individuals how to work safely and efficiently as one person. If you don't trust yourself to work alone then one man work is not for you. Pay a helper and lose some profit, that's your preference.

For clarification on Rusty's cleaning experience. Rusty tested his students that were trained by Roger, who has been cleaning hoods about 15 years. Rusty organized the testing with Roger and used Phil's manuals and the NFPA 96 and Roger's manual, which is not as well known as Phil's.

Rusty does now clean hoods. I'm guessing as a result of the problem that some people may have accepting certification by an individual who does not work in the field himself. But only Rusty can answer on his motivation.
 

Grant

Administrator
If you did fall off a ladder, and were incapacitated on the ground, the restaurant has already left for the night and you are alone. Do you wait until the morning kitchen staff arrives?
 

dodsonish

Grease Police President
Yes, or use your cell if possible. My best advice is to not fall;).

People take the risk of climbing ladders alone in many different fields of work, whether it's painting or tree trimming all work has it's dangers.
 

Michael T

Member
Safety first

dodsonish said:
Yes, or use your cell if possible. My best advice is to not fall;).

People take the risk of climbing ladders alone in many different fields of work, whether it's painting or tree trimming all work has it's dangers.

Josh, I dont want rain on your parade... too much. But when do tree trimmers trim tree's at night? :confused:
 

Stan Sauve

New member
I thought some of you might be interested in that I have been given (I hesitate to say approval) to continue with the project.
I have been asked how I have been received by both the cleaners and the restaurant owners, I am pleased to say it has "So Far" been positive.
I have scheduled a meeting with all cleaners in Calgary ( which I have 10 out of 13 who will be attending) to get their input into how they would like to see the inspections made, that is to say a base line that we all agree would be fair and equable for all. Also the President of the Alberta Restaurant Association has accepted my invitation. I am looking forward to this meeting and its outcome. Have a great day

Stan
 

dodsonish

Grease Police President
Reading too far into my example. My point is a lot of work has dangers. Our safety issues just happen to be mostly at night. Is cleaning hoods alone in the day time more safe than night time?

I trust myself climbing ladders, if you have a problem climbing ladders then stay on the ground.
 

RJTravel

Member
dodsonish said:
Matt-
For clarification on Rusty's cleaning experience. Rusty tested his students that were trained by Roger, who has been cleaning hoods about 15 years. Rusty organized the testing with Roger and used Phil's manuals and the NFPA 96 and Roger's manual, which is not as well known as Phil's.
QUOTE]

Josh,
Rusty misrepresented himself so many times it is overwhelming. Only 2 possibilities: either it was overzealousness or he suffers from a common psychological quirk which can affect all of us - i.e. if you tell yourself something often enough you will believe it. Probably a bit of both. Your effort to protect him in respect to the manuals is commendable, however I think your loyalty is ill-placed.
Richard
 

David Saulque

Senior Moderator
Eight years ago one of my managers took a fall off a ladder and had a major problem. His help called 911 and me on the cell phone and he was taken to the hospital. It was just a 12 foot roof and a manager who had no fear of height and thought that his skills exceeded everyone. He had 82 air drops in the Marines. By the way he is still with me and doing fine. If he had not had a helper, I might be the only former Marine in the company.

Working at night has its own special issues-bottom feeders, police, alarms, unseen dangers and a host of other issue that seldom create problems during the day. So to say a single man crew is as safe as a two man crew is simply ridiculas. :eek:
 

Brian Penney

New member
Hi Richard

If you get a free chance I was wondering if you could give me a call regarding some work I might be able to send your way out in your area.You can call me on my cell at 617-594-4390

Josh

That contract I was talking to you about looks like its going to happen. I will be calling you tonight.
 

RJTravel

Member
Brian,
Thanks for the offer, but we are winding down and will be gone for some time in anticipation of possible relocation. I may even give Douglas some real competition if it occurs! I will be checking my email from tiime to time - if you would care to email me I will pass along to a reliable associate who can be trusted to do a good job.
Take care all,
Richard
 

grizzley

Member
Grant said:
If you did fall off a ladder, and were incapacitated on the ground, the restaurant has already left for the night and you are alone. Do you wait until the morning kitchen staff arrives?

No... but what are the odds / percentages? Maybe 2%? 3%?

So, what you guys are saying "You could fall off a ladder and can't get help"... What about driving a car in a rural area at night? Do we need a second or perhaps a third person in the vehicle with us at all times in case we wreck our car and are knocked unconscious? But wait, you must also have a cell phone before going into the rual areas.

Or you can not change a flat tire on your car unless there is another person present in case the jack fails and the car falls on your leg?

Come on... life is FULL of "risks" and we ALL take them everyday. If a guy falls off a ladder, that is one of the chances he takes in this line of work. If a guy crashes the service truck on the way to a job and critically injures himself/the crew that is another chance he takes. What? Next you will have to have a "chase" vehicle to follow the crew to the job to make sure they make it OK?

Put a mat on the roof to clean your feet.... Put gritty paper on each rung of your ladder. Wear proper footwear. Don't stretch or reach. Secure the ladder to the building. Put 4 rungs above the roof line. Go to your local fire dept to learn ladder safety.

God forbid you fall on the guy that is heeling your ladder and you are both knocked out.

This is the "safety" that Rusty's class lacks? Give me a break....

From the American College of Surgeons Trauma Programs: Subcommittee on Injury Prevention and Control: Injuries Due to Falls from Heights:
"Most ladder injuries are due to safety precautions and regulations not being observed, and in the majority of preventable cases, precautions were ignored, resulting in patient fall."
 

David Saulque

Senior Moderator
Safety issue is just one of the benefits of a two man crew. For one you have a smother job so that you would be able to make a second job. Second a back door open at night at the rear of a restaurant is a problem that could be notched down with a second uniformed employee at the lower level.

Who cares why the accident happened, the problem is has to be dealt with fast and an injured employee lack the cognitive skill to deal with his situation. For example a head injury, back injury.

To give odds or a percentage simply misses the big picture of reducing the chances of a risk.
 
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