Hood Cleaning School

OK so lets say you get a loan for $8000 to do this school. To pay it off in 2 years it would cost you around $350 a month, thats 2 cleanings. If you lease a nice pw and truck there is say another $350 a month, another 2 cleanings. Chemicals, plastic gas etc maybe another say $300 a month thats another 2 cleanings. So to cover basic costs your looking at 6 cleanings a month. 1 guy selling and doing the work could maybe do and sell 3 jobs a week, maybe 4. So for the sake of argument lets say he sold and did 14 jobs in the first month which would give him about $1800 profit in the first month. Now he would have to do this for the next two months in the quarter before the accounts came due again (assuming they are all quarterly accounts) and if he could add on a couple of accounts each week he may get up to the point where he could be doing say 8 jobs a week which would give him around 5 grand a month in profits. As soon as the loan and the pw are paid off you could be doing pretty well.

I guess it all comes down to how well the school is going to teach you in the way of running the business. I think the hardest part would be getting leads, selling the jobs and keeping track of all the financial mumbo jumbo, if the school teaches you how to do these things by yourself, it would be worth the money.
 
I often wonder what a truly complete package would run?

I knwo i have been to seminars that cost me more than 2000.00 and i felt they where worth 200.00 and some that cost 500.00 that i felt where worth 10,000.

Its crazy what people have to offer.

I looked at a guy selling no more than 2000.00 dollars woth of equipment and a book for 12,000.. he sold 24 last year.. LOL

maybe i'm in the wrong busz.......
 
rusty ACE
it seems to me that on your home page that you keep pushing that you gotta be "certified" no where does it state that a person must "be certified" its states "certified OR PERSON (S) ACCEPTABLE TO THE A.H.J."
the AJH could be the store manager, the fire marshall or even the hood cleaner himself,
its not a law, its a recommendation if im wrong please correct me, im always willing to learn
who certified you?....... you??
I too would like to know how many stores you do or did and for how long youve been in the industrie as a hood cleaner, please do tell us

but it sounds a bit like misrepresentation to me, do you tell these people you train that its not mandatory to be "certified" or do you just kind of lead them into thinking that they "have" to be.
I guess ignorance isnt a crime, but it should be when you take advantage of it
 
I look at this like this, we all gotta start somewhere.

Rusty runs a business helping people get into the hood cleaning. Yes he is expensive. I agree he’s charging to much at least we think. What is information really worth? Only those who have paid know that.

I think other like rusty should do this but so far the only game in town is delco. Lots of there classes are 1600.00 for a few days. This is real comparable to the price Rusty is charging.

No one has certified or qualified anyone to instruct or teach anyone.
In fact the guru the guys manual that they use doesn’t even have and official accreditations that I’m aware of?

in reality how would we go about getting one. Someone is going to have to have a university adopt the program and research the information and say we accept it to be qualified.

Because its not now does it mean that its bad info? NO
 
Certification of kitchen exhaust cleaners

I think that people are so infatuated with the concept of certification that they are missing the point. We take people who have never owned a business, set them up with a complete kitchen exhaust cleaning business, including customers, and don't charge future residuals.

They become lifetime members of our new organization (name yet to be decided) and are surrounded by a network of independent kitchen exhaust cleaners whose main goal is the constant improvement of kitchen exhaust cleaning to the professional level.

Whether you agree with our price or not, we offer a product that many people have expressed a desire to have. In fact, we are booked solid thru March and only have 6 classes left until July of this year.

Are we a one size fits all solution to people who want to get into this business? No

Does the price that we charge mean that the product that we sell isn't worth it? No

Do we help people past the hurdle of starting a business and provide them with the technical training and support to start their business? Yes

I spoke with Phil Ackland about a month ago and he and Delco have had a disagreement as to how that school should be run. Now, Phil isn't even associated with Delco anymore and has moved on to Derby Pressure Washing.

He is glad that we have our school because it serves two purposes, makes his program look more affordable (which is now $3000 per person) and we are pressing forward the concept of certification of kitchen exhaust cleaners.

Now the concept of certification can be argued for days in circles but it ultimately boils down to this.... insurance companies and lawyers are demanding accountability from the kitchen exhaust cleaning industry and they are recognizing the importance of certification.

I spoke with a lawyer from New Jersey who is representing a New York restaurant who received a faulty cleaning from a non-certified kitchen exhaust cleaner and subsequently his restaurant burned down. Now this lawyer has already verified that New York City requires certification and they are going after this non-certified cleaning company.

I spoke with an insurance company in the Washington, DC/ Virginia area that was inquiring if we had any Certified Hood & Duct Cleaners in their area because they were requiring their insurance policy owners to use them.
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Whether you want to face it or not, certification is a concept that is here to stay.

So what is your resistance to supporting a truly independent network of kitchen exhaust cleaners? Is it really the price that is the root of all this controversy?

Vanderbilt, Harvard, Yale, Sewanee don't think twice about charging $50,000 to $100,000 for a degree. We all agree that one could probably get the information for free from other sources or attend state colleges or technical schools. But yet there are those who don't even attend college who are successful. So is it worth it? I guess it depends on the individual.

Thanks for your time.
 
I have a few issues with your program. When you speak of lifetime certification in itself creates a liability because the codes and equipment change and the holder should be required to have a proven proficiency. When one get a Drivers License it's not for life, one must prove that he is competent.

Your chose of equipment is suspect along with the single man process. Both issues are a serious worker comp employee safety issue. Both lend to problems at the job site.

Some very small jobs can be completed with a single man. However in this market I am using 3 man crews simply because of the complex systems, not to mentions the long runs and the morning window of client start up. The trend is for 3 man crews so that jobs are completed within the window along for the safety of my employees.

My main problem with schools like your system prepare the student for the easy jobs and once in the market they seldom run across a job that he was trained on. His real school starts after he leaves the school when he learns that his equipment is substandard and his ability begins when he applies his inter resource and figures out what to do.

regards

David
 
Lifetime membership doesn't=lifetime certification

You get a lifetime membership, your certification only is valid as long as you are actively cleaning kitchen exhaust systems.

The equipment that we sell is COMPLETELY OPTIONAL. That is they can buy our equipment, they can buy your equipment, they can buy Delco's equipment, they can buy any equipment from anyone that they desire.

Our equipment is specifically chosen to keep the initial investment down so that people can afford to get into the business.

You are right, once you start using employees it is best advised that you use 2-3 man crews. But when you are first starting out you don't have the capital required to hire several employees. Assuming you only paid $20,000/year for each employee that would require $60,000 just for their salaries, not to mention the 7.5% Fica TAX, 20% ($12,000) worker's comp. insurance payments, not to mention the monies required to buy several sets of equipment.

If you have $125,000 Plus to invest then that is the right way to go. But we start you out for $8000 and completely outfit you for $8500 or $9500 and then supply you with clients.

Our students personally clean at least 5 restaurants during their training. They aren't learning on a mock up or a mobile training center. Name any other hood cleaning school that even uses real restaurants to learn on. No one does. Not Phil Ackland, Not Delco, Not PWNA, Not IKECA.

So, your main point is that we can't teach people how to clean hoods. Well, I'm sorry that we can do what you can't. Not only do we do it, but we do it very well.

How many people learned everything that they need to know from school. Not very many. Most learn from real world experience which is what we give them by supplying them with a steady supply of clients and real world live in-the-field training.

Places like McDonald's, Burger King, Taco Bell, Dunkin Dougnuts, Cici's Pizza, Hardee's, Hyatt Hotel, Sonic, Captain D's, etc. are choosing to use our service not to mention that we specialize in ASIAN/Chinese/Japanese restaurants.

So while you say it can't be done, I have already gotten 330 restuarants for our clients.

A final point. We offer a legitimate way for a person to start a kitchen exhaust cleaning company today.

Please list every cost associated with starting a kitchen exhaust cleaning company the way that you would prefer to do it. That is how much would you, David, spend for equipment, training, employees, office space, secretaries, salesmen, insurance, chemicals, supplies, advertising. Would someone want to pay for all of this equipment, take you up for your free training and be successful? Not be certified, have no support system, and be in for a real suprise once they get back home.

You say that our equipment is sub par. How much does a complete kitchen exhaust cleaning equipment package cost if you were to purchase everything to your specifications?

Our package is clearly indicated as a BASIC package and is sold as such.

regards
 
To say that in one week you and you alone can teach a person to clean hoods and skill him in other job layers is ridiculous. I could take one person and work him with one of my crews and he would know how to clean a number of hood applications. I could give them a certification and call it lifetime. My program would have the same results of hood start up time.

So what's the difference in Phil's School vs. my school and yours. Phil has a national reputations and is considered the bench mark of this trade. He has built a reputation that is credible and workable. Your program has not met the bench mark and we have not been privileged to question you graduate on this bb. In fact we have yet to hear from anyone.

In your list of food service units, the only one that would met your standard in the donut shop. You mention the Hyatt. The Hyatt that I deal with takes 3 days and 4 employees, and it is very complicated with multi systems and levels.

David
 
Going in circles

David- you say it can't be done.

Rusty- I say it can be done.

I guess only time will tell.
 
Just want to throw in a little comment here.I don't agree with everything I saw on Rustys site but I must commend Rusty on his tenacity here.Most guys would have given up by now,after being ganged up on for so long but but he just keeps on going.I admire that.
 
I disagree with everyone and see all side of this. I see Phil akland as only having a reputation. A pretty darn good one, but how’s rusty suppose to get one if he doesn’t try?
After he has had successful students I think we will see credibility. Someone has to do it. You can look at this like research at others expense. If I felt rusty was completely taking advantage of people I would say. So far comparable to other’s he’s in the ballpark. Perhaps even offering more than the competition has.


I will say again he uses Phils manuals. Is phil the only person that can instruct from his manuals. If that’s the case then we better tell PWNA and some others org that use his stuff its no good. I think not since David speaks highly of Phil I believe his stuff is creditable and good. So in a sense that makes rusty’s class have creditability.
 
I would like to point out one flaw in Rusty's logic about start up costs...but let me preface that by saying that I don't have a problem with what he's doing....If he's upfront with what the students get for their money, they don't mind spending it, and he is responsible with how and what he teaches them, where's the problem? Of course, not being a hood cleaner myself, I have a limited ability to understand all the in's and out's of it. At any rate, the point I want to make about start up costs is this:

Yes, if you have three employees at $20k/year, you are paying roughly $70-$80k/year for salary, taxes, benefits, etc. What he was wrong about is that you need that money up front. That money is paid out over the course of the year, during which time you will have revenue coming in to cover it. Granted, you'll have to cover some of that payroll until you start seeing a steady cash flow, but you certainly don't have to come up with it all at once. As far as cash flow goes, if you're ready to hire three employees, you've probably got some money coming in already.

Just my $.02 worth.
 
Build your business to as big as you want it

That's exactly what I'm saying.

Start out as a 1 man operation, build your cash flow to the point that it is obvious that you need to hire additional help.

Then if you want hire additional help and build your company to any size that you want.

Not everybody has the luxury of starting out a $100K business overnight.

Some (most) couldn't afford to do this.

Our costs are in line with our competitors. $8000 for 2 people, all manuals included, including Master Documents Manual, real-world-on-the-rooftop-at-night-in-the-grease cleaning restaurants. Learning in real world situations how to drape, how to clean around the Ansul systems, how to collect waste water, access panels, customer service, marketing in the field, time-management, paperwork, accounting & bookeeping, chemicals, safety, powerwasher maintenance, tool usage, practical tips on starting your business, continuous phone support, guaranteed clients (via complete marketing packages), certification based on NFPA 96 standards using Phil Ackland's Certification of Kitchen Exhaust Cleaners manual-- not to mention a lifetime membership in our to be announced National Organization of Independent Certified Hood & Duct Cleaners. All this done 1 on 1. No class room full of 30 people.

Phil Ackland charges $3000 per student (up to 30) (no hands on real world experience). No equipment offered but you get to watch a real business work (no hands on).

Delco/PWNA mobile "Delco University" costs $2000 per student (discount with extra student.) Their 'Basic Kitchen Exhaust Cleaning Equipment' costs $7500 and doesn't include a trailer, ladders, buckets, scrapers, magnets, plastic, etc. Certification is extra and not included in the course.
 
Rusty
Are you a reputable cleaner? I can only assume so without some investigation which I have no desire to do and you could say the same for me. I won't question your methods, from what I can tell you do pretty much the same as everyone else. We all develop different techniques over the years. The bottom line is are we removing the grease and make the system fire safe.
I do however question you making a point of telling everyone that this can be a one-man job exclusively. My experience tells me that only the simplest jobs can be done this way in a timely manner and I don't seem to run into many of those, and that is not taking into account the safety of the guy climbing up on roofs by himself at night usually. Most of my customers would not want to hang around the extra time it would take if we only used one man
 
Let's see:

We've been cleaning exhaust systems for 10 years.

If it took us longer as a 1 man operation to clean an exhaust system we wouldn't be successful.

1 man doesn't spend time talking and chatting and wasting time... what he does is completely focus on the task at hand and using time management skills quickly and accurately cleans the exhaust system. Since you don't have the back up system of an extra person to stand around and make sure the draping doesn't fall, you become extremely efficient at wrapping a hood in such a way that it doesn't come loose or fall off.

We've been selling business opportunities for 8 years (in the current format for the past 1 1/2 years, as a Franchise previously to that).

We've been listed with the BBB with no complaints from any of our clients (kitchen exhaust cleaning) for 10 years.

We've been listed with the BBB with no complaints from any of our clients (business opportunity owners) for 10 years.

We're listed in the yellow pages for the past 10 years.

We've got hundreds of satisfied clients who constantly refer our company to others.

We practice what we preach, Roger is a 1 man cleaning machine, in his 50's.

We specialize in cleaning kitchen exhaust systems, which is our primary source of income.

We use the most up to date material to teach from (Phil Ackland's Certification Manual &, NFPA 96 2001 edition.)

We teach the cleaning methods and techniques that keep reputable companies in business.

Just because you 'believe' a hood can't be cleaned with 1 person doesn't make it impossible.

We're insured for millions of dollars.

We're licensed to clean kitchen exhaust systems.

We do business right. That is what we teach. That is what we follow up with our clients and teach them.
 
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A letter that I received today....

The following from a letter that I received today from one of our recent business owners:

Letter dated 2/10/3.

"Dear Roger,

Thank you for this opportunity that you have given my family. Business is looking good. There are many interests in our hood cleaning service. I have bid on about 20 jobs, completed 2, and have 3 scheduled in the next few weeks. I will be hearing from the owner of the Waffle House about his other 4 restaurants either today or tomorrow. All of this in my first week of operation. None of this would have been made possible without the training and support that I have received from you and Rusty. Thanks again and God bless.

Sincerely,

Joshua D. Dodson
Owner/President
Dodson Hood & Duct Service"

Just as a side note, I received a call from Josh today (2/11/3) and Josh got the Waffle Houses that he mentioned above.
 
Joshua Dodson if you are reading this, your letter that Rusty has posted says "3 scheduled in the next few weeks" Did you get the add on package with guaranteed customers? I don't know if Rusty explained to you that you will need to do an average of three jobs a night to feed your family, but three in the next few weeks, although a start is going to be tough.
I hope you are succesful in this business, but in order for that to happen, you will have to spend all your daylight hours selling yourself to restaurant owners so that you can work at night also.

Good luck and let us know how much benifit you got from Grease University.
 
Rusty,

Let's see:

You have been cleaning exhaust systems for 10 years, and you've
been selling business opportunities for 8 years. So with two years experience you were ready to revolutionize the entire industry with a new and improved one man band approach.

The BBB was quite an organization...20 years ago, now most consumers (especially restaurants) don't realize it still exists!

The yellow page ad is hardly any proof of credibility, all you need is a phone number and some money and presto you have a yellow page ad.

" a 1 man cleaning machine, in his 50's." Should a 50 year old man be on a ladder at night, with wet boots and no one else around to help him pull h.p. hose to the roof?

"We're insured for millions of dollars." As a school or as a hood cleaner? or for when a 50 year old man is found laying in the parking lot, next to his ladder one morning by the A.M. manager of the restaurant

"We're licensed to clean kitchen exhaust systems" by WHO?
 
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