We're furious...got any suggestions?

B

Beth & Rod

SR Wood Geek / Moderator
Ok, here's the scoop...
Rod and I washed the exterior of a property (small job but still) for a commercial client. It was night work, due to customers coming and going. The customer came up with an excuse at about 2:00 am about his wife taking the checkbook home and how he loved the work and could he mail the check the next day.... we were exhausted and said sure. He left, we finished, and got home about 3:15 am. Well, that was on APRIL 23rd. Since then we have tried to call him, I have sent him a statement with a massive late fee, nothing got his attention until I called the cell phone this morning (only phone he has - his business has no phone) and said hey, pay up or we go to court.

So now he's all bent out of shape.... I had spoken to his wife, who he said cuts the checks but now all of a sudden she has nothing to do with it. The whole thing stinks. Meanwhile he owes us $693.00!!!

Any suggestions?

Beth & Rod
:mad: :mad: :confused: :confused:
 
Beth, sorry to hear about the jerks we have to deal with sometimes….


I can only offer this advice know your collection rights in your state. Go through the proper steps, you can file a lien but we all know that wont get you paid until the property changes hands or they try to borrow against.

File a small claim at the local court house… about 75.00 more dollars.. I have found they usually pay before their court date. People that are deadbeats know that when they go to court and loose they will owe more. This sometimes works.

Make sure you have documented he was happy with the service. Get out your video camera in case he tries to dispute that he was not happy.

Good luck, sorry again about people that become idiots… we all have them……
 
If it were me, I would send a series of letter stating what you had completed and the cost plus the late charge. If nothing I would repeat the same letter with second notice and make it certified. Then if nothing, I would file in small claims court, and you have done everything based on what is reasonable. Then I would put a lien based on the judgement and cost.

David
 
Thanks you guys. That's pretty much where we are now. I'm ready to write the letter. Rod did talk to the guy and there is supposed to be a "check" in the mail for half. He wants Rod to come out and see if he can make it a little cleaner, which sounds suspiciously like more work for free. This guy kept saying how much he loved it and how great it looked. He was falling all over himself, and I was a witness to it. I told Rod if he does go out there, don't even start the washer up until he pays the balance due.

I will not hesitate to take him to court. I know we'll win, and I'm not at all afraid to try. He's lied through his teeth too many times for me to believe anything he says. Money talks. It's time for him to pay. It was due upon completion, and he knew it when he said he was sorry he couldn't pay that night because his wife "took the checkbook home."

Beth
 
"I have found they usually pay before their court date."

Beth the above quote from Ron is true so if you do go to court and he offers to pay first insist he pay all court and filing fees too or simply say sorry but we want every penny you owe us.

The judge will tack on those fees if you win so why should you not insist on them too.

I would not even consider doing work for him again, touch up or otherwise. He is scamming you two and your way to busy to waste more time on him.

Jon
 
Well, the practical joker in me wants to go out there with a pump up sprayer full of water or colored water, and tell him it is a highly corosive chemical and unless he pays I'll spray his property. Tell him that withing 48 hours it will eat it alllll away. Then count to ten, and start spraying and watch him freak out, pee himself, and run for the check book. Of course, I would have another sprayer of colored water that would counteract the first .... hahahahaha

I agree Jon, and I told Rod he shouldn't do anything else but he is trying to at least give the guy a fair shake.

@!#$^%&@!#$^&!@!#%^&@!#$&

I think he's scamming us (or trying to) too! And I'm not putting up with it. Pay up pal, or me and the colored water are comming to visit!

Beth
 
Maybe you could contact Ron P. in New Jersey or John T. (CleanCounty) in Long Island. I am sure they could get you in contact with some gentlemen that "solve problems" for a living. Kidding, i am just a Soprano's freak.

jon
 
Well, whats the big deal..........its only been just over twenty days.......?

Do you have a contract with him for immediate payment?
 
Beth,
If the guy doesn't pay the next time you ask then you will have to bleed him.

What this means is take a bat to his head and knock him out. Throw him in the car and take him to a place that nobody can find him. Make sure he is tied up.

Then cut one of his main vains so he slowly bleeds to death(He will scream a little here but just laugh it off). Once that is done you can now use a chain saw on him to cut him into small pieces. It won't be to messy because you already bled him. Then throw him to the fishes. This should do the trick.

Or better yet just take the slacker to court where the judge can make a ruling on this.

I am also a Soprano fan;)
 
Hope this helps next time. We require a 30% non-refundable deposit before we start the job. We take the money to the bank first!!! At least you have your chemicals and machine wear and tear covered.

If you run into any problems up front with the 30%...you'll likely have problems collecting the rest.

99% of our customers write us a check when we do the estimate and never have a problem with it. The other one's that do balk about the 30%, we tell them to call us when they have decided what thay want to do. Since doing this, we've never not gotten paid!

I know this doesn't help this time but maybe next time it will.

Sorry!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:eek:
 
Do you have a properly executed contract signed by the responsible person? In the state in which we primarily operate the body of law has changed over the last year or so. If brought to any state court it would not get past the court clerk - it would be declared unmeritorious if no properly worded contract and then summarily dismissed. There simply is no S.O.B. law in place. You have no standing. Sorry.

The ideas suggested are that which we would like to do, however in real life it is unlikely you will cut him in pieces. We have an associate who did have a solution. Spent hours cleaning the exhaust system and then client declared he could not pay. At least there was no pretense. Our associate went back on the roof and removed the exhaust fan. At opening time next morning a frantic call was received - he paid in cash for the cleaning and full fan servicing before operations could resume. Our associate was a 'service invitee' therefore it would have been very difficult to make criminal or tortious claims.

I have been self-employed since the 60s and have never been stiffed, but I have a plan in place if I ever suffer severe loss for non-payment. If a public place (such as a restaurant) I will find some legal infraction for which I would call the local constabulary and meet them right at the front entrance - not my fault it would be at the start of the busy dinner hour and that it could be an embarrassment for the owner to engage me in a shouting match in front of his preferred clientele. I then have all the ground and could legally cause much discomfort. This I really would do.

Richard
 
Rod and Beth.......

sorry that you are having trouble collecting... What I used to do was go to their place of business and hangout for the day if needed. Drives them crazy especially when others are finding out that you are owed money. Also,when five o'clock quitting time rolls around and you are still there and not planning on leaving. sure makes for an uncomfortable situation on their part.

Kind of takes some strong will power to pull it off but it usually works.

I would never get belligerent or arrogant with them in any way. I would just tell them that I need to have my check ....now ! And I don't have time to come back another day. If your wife has the checkbook we will both wait until she gets here. Or, we can go to the ATM machine together. We can go to the bank and draw a counter check. What ever !!

Stand your ground and don't waiver. Really take charge when you get there and don't back down for nothing. But remember. Don't ever do anything that can be taken as physically threatening in any way. Always be polite but firm. And don't leave without your check.if they tell you they are going to call the police tell them that would be ideal !!!!

worst-case scenario is that the check they give you may be no good. However, it is better to have a "bad check" than no check at all.

Deposit their check and if it comes back posted as "insufficient funds" redeposit and wait again.

if it comes back again as insufficient funds the second time send a certified letter.

If the certified letter is not received do it again. now you have redeposited the check twice and tried twice to reach the person by certified letter.

Now you have done everything that the law requires you to do for taking out a warrant. Then you can go down to the courthouse before the magistrate and take out a "felony warrant" for writing bad money. they will go to his residence and take him downtown fairly quick. Trust me it works. I locked up a guy in Virginia two years ago for doing the same thing.

try to have him locked up on a Friday if possible. The judge doesn't work weekends and he will sit in the cooler until Monday morning. That's what I did. He almost went away for a year. However, the deal was with the attorneys involved that he pays cash money for the checks and I drop the felony charges.

collections are difficult sometimes.... be tough you will get your money.

Dan Swiderski (not Dan S )
 
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We did get 1/3 down (thank goodness).

Mike, the balance was due that night when the job was done. We juggled the schedule around to suit this guy so he could pass his corporate inspection, the whole nine yards. He has lied three times about the payment so far, he has lied abd the woman with the checkbook being the wife, now he says that's not his wife, just an employee, and I don't think he has the money or if he does he is just looking for more work for free. I could go on and on about things he's said that are not true, or that have changed in context.

If I had not made my early morning cage rattling call yesterday, he never would have called here so that we could open a dialog. I have no problem taking him to court. It's just a hassle.

Beth
 
ron p

Jon, I know a guy. As a matter of fact I know a couple of guys. Not Soprano types but they like riding on 2 wheels.
Beth that colored water thing can be conscrewed as a terroristic threat and land you in the pokey.
It will also be conciderd defaceing his property and he can back charge you for the clean-up.
Take it to small claims court but they wont touch it untill its 130 days old unless he signed something diffrent.
What i would do is hire a kid to picket in front of his biz. with a sign that says something about bad biz. practices. Nothing personal, that will get you in trouble. So long as your picketer is on public property there is nothing they can do.
I did this in front of a persons home once
[not related to my pressure washing biz.]
He came out and offered me a check, I made him go get cash.
Its the squeky wheel that gets the grease.
 
I would never do the colored water thing, it's just the practical joker/creative side of me that thinks these things up. I did think of picketting, and there is a public side walk I could use. Boycott signs are bad for biz....

Richard, he did sign agreeing to pay on the date the service was rendered, and yes, it said it was due upon date of completion. Also Rod and I were both there and he said on more than one occasion that the work was excellent and he loved it. He even brought us bottled water at about 2am before he left and stiffed us. He worked us over pretty well. Made it sound like he didn't want to leave without paying and were we sure it would be ok if he mailed the check the next day, all smiles and happy, and he sounded like he was in a bind. Turn out the checkbook was there all along! I even gave the guy an envelope that was already addressed.

When he called he made a comment to Rod asking if it would be inconvenient for Rod to have to come all the way back out.... red flag. (he's an hour away) He has also flat out refused to pay as well as lying abut sending a check. Says if we want the money we have to come out there and do more work (which was not in the agreement). This guy is alllll over the place.

Many years ago my job was A/R and collections for a small business. Hated it. But I did learn about deadbeats and the way they behave. This guy is a classic one.

I don't think we will have trouble winning in court for these reasons. (he did sign) What I want to know is do we have to attach to the commercial property or can we attach to his residential property?

The one cell phone is it for business and his residence. And, it has changed along the way too... I am concerned the latest one will be disconnected soon.

Beth
 
Try this! Go to your county courthouse and get a demonstration permit. Make up a few signs, park your truck out front and march in front of his business until he pays you. All this of course after you file a complaint with the BBB (better business bureau). Call the local news station and see if they will do one of those irritating news stories at 5:00. Of course let him know you are going to do it...might get him in gear. Write the newspaper editor. I t might get published.

Finally, you might try what a man in Memphis did about 8 years ago. He bought a Toyota car that he thought was a lemon. Dealership did all they could and still didn't satisfy him. He put the car on a trailer, made a huge sign out of plywood, put lemon stickers all over it and wrote on the sign where he bought it, it was a lemon and the dealership didn't stand behind their work. This guy rode up and down the street in front of the dealership for years on saturdays.

So, make you a big sign out of plywood, write on it the guy is a dedbeat and doesn't pay his bill's on time and ride back in forth in front of his business!!!

You gotta' love the Constitution! Freedom of speech. Don't laugh. You can do it and it's not illegal. Just check with an attorney about what language to use.
 
You guy's all missed something that I noticed. It was for a corporate inspection. That means there is still someone that he has to answer to, and needs to comply with, even if it is a franchise. I think that I would go to the effort and find out who the person that he reports to is, and contact him or her. They can really bring a lot of pressure to bear, and could pull his franchise if he does not comply. The MacDonalds and 7-11's of the world do not want anyone to sully there name, and will pull franchises for not paying the bills. It shows fiscal irresponsibility. That means that they are not capable of managing a store.

As for th picketing thing, I wouldn't do that. I would not want to make it appear as if I was a whiner, even though I would be in the right.
( although it would be fun to spill a couple of thirst busters on teh catwalk at 3:00 in the morning!! )
Scott
 
Not familiar with laws and precedential decisions in the state in which you operate, but in my state the fact that he signed a contract in which he agreed to pay on date certain is not sufficient. Here service contracts require more that that, and without the required verbiage you have nothing. Neither is the fact (assuming it is a provable fact) that he lied to you of any value whatsoever. It is not against the law to lie unless it is a sworn depo, e.u.o., or an affidavit. Sorry.

When you learn his business formation you will then have the ammo you need. Hope it is a general partnership. He would then soon learn the major disadvantage of a g.p. - unlimited liability. Under the 'severalibility' concept you could collect in full from any partner - from personal assets - whether or not that partner is involved. Next best hope is a sole prop. If a corp, sub-S, LLC, LLP, etc, it would then be much more difficult since it is much harder to burst the veil.

You could allow him to tender a check. He may know that there are insufficient funds and this could be a device to buy time to escape, but there is an alternative. Take the check to the bank and ask if there is enough to cover the check. If not then ask how much deposit is needed to cover. Make out a counter deposit for the deficit and cash the check simultaneously. This is a little-known legal ploy to capture most of your loss.

I sincerely hope you recover for your honest efforts.

Richard
 
Beth, I too have been stiffed a few times. Report them to the credit bureau. Even if you don't collect it will be on their credit file for SEVEN YEARS!!, that way they can remember you. I have more respect for someone that puts a gun in my face than this type of customer. They always get theirs in the end.
 
Beth you mentioned he signed papers saying he would pay when the job was done.

That paper is all you need. Send him a copy and give him x number of days to pay buy certified check or you will take him to court, period.

The x number of days should be very short since he has already proven he is not to be trusted.

No more messing around with trying to collect from him, just do it and be done with it.

And like Steven said, report him to the BBB and local Chamber, that does more harm since he will be known to all members as a dead beat.

Or find an attorney friend to send that pay or else letter, I bet if he gets a letter from an attorney you get paid very fast.

Now off the computer and get it over with, stop fussing around lady:)

Jon
 
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