Question

kmjt1021

kmjt1021

Member
A system that walks the line between accessible and inaccessible area's (example: I don't know about your area but around here this happens allot, a duct that runs along the top of the hood with several duct that drop to the hood, with one main run from the center of this duct up to a single fan, sometime it's more extreme than others, I'm attempting to attach a drawing to help explain)

Now I cannot see this area, but experience tells me that this area is most likely getting cleaned, but I can't be sure. Do you consider this area inaccessible?
 

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Bryan,
Sometimes. Locally, very often a split duct will have an access panel above the main flue accessible above the ceiling tiles. I know you are aware of this - you are vastly more experienced than me - but perhaps it is different in your area. When it lacks access or it cannot be opened we then try to flood the horizontals with 250 degree water. That usually does it. If all this fails I have some flexible, very thin steel (like a hand saw) that takes a variable extension pole with which I can slide into areas and slice out the bulk of the buildup. Not perfect, but it works. Have you any tools such as this?

Richard
 
Stick a camera up there and take a picture. It may be getting cleaned just by whatever you are doing the the vertical and the plenum. If not that idea that RJ had with the saw blades sounds like it would work. I'll bet there is an access panel up there somewhere though or a spot to cut one. I say if I can get a camera in there, I can clean it e.g. its accessible.
 
Ok you guys missed my point I think. The question is in area's where you can't see, by any means, but you think most likely got cleaned, do you consider them inaccessible.

I usually use a duct spinner on a flex wand in these situations, I have even been able to push it up one duct attached to a hose only and get it to come out the other side on occasion. Now even in this case I was not able to physically see this area, but I am pretty sure it was adequately cleaned. I still noted that it was inaccessible, would you have noted it this way as well?

RJ Do you have a pic of the saw thingy you mentioned?
 
Bryan,
I would note it as inaccessible area anyway. In respect to the thin steel I wish I knew how to post a pic, but my 'puter learning curve has peaked. I was fortunate to work with a previous auto body man - he can fabricate anything. I even have a 'hoe' type device (no bad jokes please) into which I can attach a pole in order to reach over 20 feet into horizontals to pull out the majority of the buildup before p/w - saves a heap of time and cleanup. The thin steel allows bend around corners to access areas which otherwise would be nearly impossible. Now if only I could borrow your midget about whom we spoke 3 years ago - you remember - you use him to access night drop vaults at you local banks.

Richard
 
Matt sometimes the duct is to long and I can't do the camera thing, I guess I could get a remote controlled camera and attach it to a pole.

Richard, I had to let the midget err uh err little guy go, I found out he was skimming some money off the top, jeesh I was paying the little guy $7.00 an hr. The nerve of some people. Oh and a shhhhh I don't want anyone to know.

By the way what is the scraper thing made of (what kind of metal) I have an idea you mail it to me and I'll post a picture of it.
 
Richard, that design is called a pant leg duct. Usually code allows up to 12 feet of plenum to be serviced by one duct. More than 12 feet requires 2 ducts, which can join together, then going to wherever the duct outlet/fan happen to be. Often the pant leg is hidden abov the ceiling, and may not be accessable. I recently installed a fire suppression system in a chinese resturant. The hood was 23 feet, w/3 outlets to the horizontal duct. The horizontal duct did lay right on the hood, exited to the right, made a 90* turn to vertical and then to the fan. So basically the system is designed with 2 plenums, one on top of the other. I do not understand how this can be efficient. Of course, this system as installed is impossible to clean as there is no access panel at the change of direction. I am not going to ask the local building inspector as I already made him mad. He told the electrician that the fan had to shut off when the fire system tripped. I called the inspector on that bit of misinformation and gave him a page from the Amerex Installation Manual showing the system was tested and listed to operate with the fan on or off. I then asked him if he wanted similar pages from Ansul, Pyro Chem, Range Guard and Kidde. He declined. I want my next career to be a building inspector, specializing in fire trades.

Bryan, what is a "flex wand" and where do I get one?

Douglas Hicks
General Fire Equipment Co of Eastern Oregon, Inc
 
I think Delco also sells something like that. There was a discussion on one of the boards about that thing not holding the angle and straitening out. Has that happened to you?

Bryan, I am also sending one of my trained squirrels to pack that camera into the duct for you as I can see all you have is a fat little wimpy rodent for help. For a recent photo of my squirrell, go to Dan's Board and click on the pictures. you may want to warn your rodent not go out alone.

Douglas Hicks
General Fire Equipment Co of Eastern Oregon, Inc
 
We'll there you go, as ong as the duct is big enough, no more inccessible excuses. now we only have to figure out how to charge for using this thing
 
Those robotic video inspection systems are super expensive,I don't know about aircares,but the last one I looked at were $26,000.Way too expensive for me.I have 2 chimscan video inspection systems,they are around $2800 each new,I bought them on ebay from different people(paid $400 for 1 and $107 for the other,and they are both mint,gotta love that Ebay!).They come with the closed circuit camera with 6 led lights,built into sturdy aluminum body 3"x3", 50' video cable(you can buy longer ones),industrial ikegami monitors with remote controlled focus,and lighting controls,all in a protective hard case.I bought 2 portable industrial battery operated vcr's with dubbing where you can add audio comments,to make vcr tape copies of your inspections of the whole system,or you can take a picture right off the remote monitor screen .The cameras can be mounted on a robotic cart,or connect flexible chimney rods together and send it into the duct.They can be used to video inspect the inside of chimneys,airducts,or kitchen exhaust systems.Sewer video inspection systems can be used too.
I plan on building a robotic cart,its not that hard,pretty much just like the rc toy cars.Yes I dig toys and gadgets,and overkill is my middle name! Here's the site to see what it looks like www.chimscan.com
Jim
 
UHHH yeah ok, or I can suggest an access panel, and mark it inaccessible.

That is actually very interesting, can you actually tell what you are seeing, can you tell the difference between 1/4 inch build up and two inches
 
Bryan,I did say I was into overkill lol! I actually bought them for chimney inspections,to check for cracks in the flue tiles and missing mortar joints.I haven't even used either one of them yet.I will be branching out into chimneys and airducts this coming fall.Relining chimneys is very lucrative,and the chim scan is required for a level 2 inspection on chimneys,and provides documentation for the insurance company payng for the reline job.The one guy I bought one system from retired from doing chimneys,but one month he did over $20,000 in reline jobs with just himself and a helper.It can be used for kitchen exhausts also.The quality of picture is excellent,you can zoom right up to the wall of the chimney or duct and it is crystal clear,and it has 6 LED lights around the camera lens that you can adjust from the control panel.All the components are heavy duty industrial grade,that is why they are so expensive.I think in the last 4 years only 4 were listed on ebay,and I bought 2 of the 4. If you want to see what the picture looks like click on this link www.chimscan.com and then click on application and it shows the monitor with a picture on it ,it really is very clear in person.
 
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